
Harmony OS and Compatibility - ingve
http://commonsware.com/blog/2019/08/10/harmony-compatibility.html
======
roca
> Simply making an operating system open source is insufficient on its own to
> guarantee success. If it were, Ubuntu Phone and Firefox OS would be
> significant players. Unfortunately, neither “crossed the chasm”, in part due
> to lack of manufacturer and carrier support.

Actually FirefoxOS pretty much has "crossed the chasm". It's just that that
happened after Mozilla abandoned it and KaiOS took it over. They've shipped
100M units. [https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/22/kaios-raises-50m-more-
hits...](https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/22/kaios-raises-50m-more-
hits-100m-handsets-powered-by-its-feature-phone-os/) Weird that a mobile-
focused developer site would miss this.

It's true that Huawei open-sourcing HarmonyOS is no guarantee of success, but
that's a bit obvious.

~~~
rahimnathwani
Earlier in the same article, they quote "Huawei will need to solve the biggest
hole in the adoption of Harmony OS: the app ecosystem".

I think that's part of what they're talking about when they say these others
never crossed the chasm.

And, yes, KaiOS has crossed the chasm, but I don't see:

\- that being open source helped with carrier deals and hence adoption, or

\- that they've solved the app ecosystem issue

~~~
fabrice_d
Having official apps for WhatsApp, FB, GMaps, Youtube, Google Voice Assistant,
Twitter helps a lot with the ecosystem part.

------
jhcl
I am not a mobile developer nor am I a web developer but can't Huawei base
their apps on web apps?

That would mean they could port any web app from IOS or android to Harmony OS
as long as there are no native bindings as react native has. Eventually they
can incorporate webassembly when that really gets of the ground.

~~~
s_y_n_t_a_x
Wouldn't be very battery (or other resource) friendly.

------
Tinfoilhat666
Android and iPhone app stores are already saturated. The app store for
HarmonyOS isn't. This could be a good opportunity for new mobile app
developers.

~~~
Kipters
The same thing has been told referring to the Windows Phone 7 Marketplace
though

~~~
addicted
This OS, if it’s anh good, should at least have the Chinese market locked up
though. Which is a few hundred million users.

If it’s good, and Huawei follows up on making it truly open source, I suspect
every Chinese manufacturer would at least have a line of Harmony OS phones,
because they could always be the next trade war target.

And once the Chinese manufacturers are supporting it, you can also add a huge
chunk of the South and South East Asian markets as your customer base as well,
since a lot of users in those areas basically just buy the latest Xiaomi or
Huawei phones.

------
JohnStrangeII
Of all the efforts at an alternative mobile OS so far, Harmony OS seems to
have the best chances of success, because it is backed up by the Chinese state
and its pervasive surveillance apparatus. With government help and full
integration into the total surveillance of all Chinese citizens, they can get
their share of the Chinese market and break the application barrier.

~~~
pjmlp
As if Google and Apple don't have to obey the wishes of FBI, CIA, NSA,...
regarding "making the world safer".

~~~
JohnStrangeII
The US doesn't have a citizen score, political re-education camps, Tiananmen
Square massacre, widespread censorship (like disconnecting a phone when you
say a certain word), filtering of all foreign content and blocking of sites
like Wikipedia or New York Times, BBC News, massive displacements and forced
re-settlements, a vast number of political prisoners, massive squelching of
protests and demonstrations (right now, there are videos of large troop
movements towards Hong Kong), and so on. Not to speak of Tibet...

Anyway, my point was not primarily meant political, it was more that Huawei
has good chances of succeeding with this OS, because they are backed up and
supported by the Chinese government. That's true even if you are 100% pro
Chinese one-party government.

~~~
pjmlp
You mean like Guantanamo?

Or the ones managed by CIA outside American borders to do it more cleanly?

~~~
camgunz
Guantanamo is bad, no question. But there's a chasm between holding 800
foreign nationals (and, from time to time, traitorous Americans) and rounding
up millions of ethnic minorities for re-education based on their race,
religion, or politics. If you looked up false equivalence in the dictionary,
this would be Exhibit A.

~~~
pjmlp
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haska_Meyna_wedding_party_ai...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haska_Meyna_wedding_party_airstrike)

~~~
camgunz
Moving the goalposts isn't helpful; let's skip to the end. I'm no believer in
American Exceptionalism. I've read A People's History, I'm pretty familiar
with the crisis of mass incarceration and the general failure of our criminal
justice system, I'm well-informed about widespread domestic surveillance and
espionage programs, and I'm deeply cynical about US foreign policy as a whole.

But even someone like me has to admit that the US is closer to a free state
than China. Here's why I think that:

\- Our court system is constantly in the throes of "freedom" vs. "tyranny"
(lots of judges disagree with _Citizens United_ , for example.

\- We have a free press that is _constantly_ critical of our president and
government.

\- I can be critical of our president and government with absolutely no
repercussions from my government.

\- We give billions in foreign aid.

\- We still accept tons of asylum and immigration applications \- In fact many
of our cities are "sanctuary cities" for immigrants

\- We celebrate the history of Americans who have fought for fundamental
freedoms and civil rights

\- We are the most diverse nation on the planet, and many of us are intensely
proud of it.

\- We have free elections.

    
    
      - Don't @ me about election problems; they're still nothing like the fraudulent elections in Russia/China/etc.
    

\- We have healthy opposition parties.

\- We actually believe the US is a work in progress, not "perfect as it is"
(see: "a more perfect union").

Sure there's a lot of work to do. And I'm sympathetic to the fact that China
and Russia face different challenges than we do. But I absolutely refuse to
accept the assertion that the US is anywhere near the same point on the
authoritarian spectrum as they are. Such comparisons are facile, ignorant, and
reinforce a nihilistic vision of Western, classically liberal values that is
at the root of the rise of nationalism and authoritarianism -- which is itself
responsible for the destruction of many millions of lives across the world.
These things are not the same, any more than Democrats and Republicans are the
same. One is clearly better than the other, and it is literally a matter of
life and death that we figure that out.

------
jotm
If only Huawei devices will use it, it's doomed. I've said it before and got
downvoted, but here's the truth again: Android's app ecosystem is what makes
it popular, followed by the huge number of manufacturers using it.

Microsoft failure with Windows Phone was partly because even after
incentivizing developers, they still could not get a critical mass of apps on
their platform. Plus any new apps were not getting WP versions along with
Android/iOS.

Huawei is huge, but not outside China, for consumers. Couple that with
everyone being wary of their spyware and whatnot. Samsung tried this at some
point with Tizen, but quickly gave up, as well.

~~~
iforgotpassword
> Microsoft failure with Windows Phone was partly because even after
> incentivizing developers, they still could not get a critical mass of apps
> on their platform. Plus any new apps were not getting WP versions along with
> Android/iOS.

My thoughts exactly. For the Chinese market everything might work out just
fine, as the article says. But for the west, as soon as one or two killer apps
won't get ported, it's game over. I think Google never did for Windows phone,
which probably did play an important role (among the many other mistakes made.
Microsoft didn't exactly make it easy to jump into app development, probably
due to arrogance.)

If harmony doesn't get YouTube, Facebook, Spotify or Snapchat, it doesn't
matter how great the OS is under the hood.

~~~
addicted
Other than YouTube, all the other apps have a vested interest in seeing a new
competitor to Google controlled Android.

If Harmony OS is a decent and open OS, I suspect they will all jump onto it.

The only concern may be Google apps, but then, it’s possible that Google may
also create Harmony OS supported apps so they can access the Chinese market.

~~~
iforgotpassword
That's a good point, but it's also a hen and egg problem. If the platform
isn't that widespread you might be hesitant to support it. (assuming it's not
actually super easy to port over Android apps as suggested).

While Windows phone definitely was a very different platform from both IOS and
Android, it was still amazing how shoddy some major players' apps ran on it.
Stability, performance and features were often lacking. The tools,
documentation and lack of sample code was definitely to blame, but even then
you still need to learn a new platform.

